I'm fairly sure Arundel rum is not altered.
Callwood Rum Distillery
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ns4UFQaNju8
Request from Dai: A list of unaltered rums...
Cracked a bottle of Travelers 5 Barrel from Belize last night and I wouldn't be surprised if was unaltered.
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Capn's Log: Travelers was interviewed by a Caribbean newspaper and admitted the 1 Barrel is altered. Since my understanding that the 5 barrel is just an aged version, well, you do the math...
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Capn's Log: Travelers was interviewed by a Caribbean newspaper and admitted the 1 Barrel is altered. Since my understanding that the 5 barrel is just an aged version, well, you do the math...
So now we have:
Sea Wynde
Barbancourt 3 Star, 5 Star and Estate du Domaine (15)
Braasch
Koloa -(maybe)
Roaring Fortie's
Prichards
Wild Days
Seale's Ten
Doorly's (5 year and XO)
Old Brigand
Barbados Special
Tommy Bahama
Clement Single Cask
Scarlet Ibis
Smith & Cross?
Wray & Nephew Overproof? (I mean obviously it's not colored, but it's basically also just straight from the still, right?
Also, not that I've had them, but what about the El Dorado single-still rums (Port Morant, ICBU, etc)
Which of these, and which other rums that may have minor additives, are 100% pot still products?
Sea Wynde
Barbancourt 3 Star, 5 Star and Estate du Domaine (15)
Braasch
Koloa -(maybe)
Roaring Fortie's
Prichards
Wild Days
Seale's Ten
Doorly's (5 year and XO)
Old Brigand
Barbados Special
Tommy Bahama
Clement Single Cask
Scarlet Ibis
Smith & Cross?
Wray & Nephew Overproof? (I mean obviously it's not colored, but it's basically also just straight from the still, right?
Also, not that I've had them, but what about the El Dorado single-still rums (Port Morant, ICBU, etc)
Which of these, and which other rums that may have minor additives, are 100% pot still products?
I must respectfully disagree on two points.
The first being that we shouldn't beat ourselves up over the purity of rum. i think we should strive to encourage rum producers to leave out the 'extra's'. I think adding colour is a waste of time and adding flavour is cheating and detrimental. Of course we shouldn't lose our minds over it as life is too short but we should definitely not give up.
Secondly, I personally WILL stop drinking rum and have stopped drinking some brands that are altered even though the taste is pleasant or passable. If the over all standard of rum does not get better then I'll be drinking fewer and fewer brands and looking only for those that are completely unaltered. Same with Scotch.
Colour I can live with but question the sense in it. I mean who told these companies that customers expect uniform colour across bottlings?
Flavour......no way.
The first being that we shouldn't beat ourselves up over the purity of rum. i think we should strive to encourage rum producers to leave out the 'extra's'. I think adding colour is a waste of time and adding flavour is cheating and detrimental. Of course we shouldn't lose our minds over it as life is too short but we should definitely not give up.
Secondly, I personally WILL stop drinking rum and have stopped drinking some brands that are altered even though the taste is pleasant or passable. If the over all standard of rum does not get better then I'll be drinking fewer and fewer brands and looking only for those that are completely unaltered. Same with Scotch.
Colour I can live with but question the sense in it. I mean who told these companies that customers expect uniform colour across bottlings?
Flavour......no way.
in goes your eye out
I tend to agree about tolerating color - Smith & Cross for example is such a fantastic product, and so lightly colored (I mean they haven't tried to make it look like it spent year after year in a barrel) that I still count it as unaltered.
I raised a question with Jimbo about Myer's Legend, which got a 10.5 aggregate score, but obviously has loads of coloring and other stuff added. He said
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Capn's Log: The scoring on the Legend was a bit tongue-in-cheek (insofar as Sue Sea's "12"), but "9" I gave it is accurate. We also stated on the review: "It is the umami of spirits and is truly a history of rum in a glass. One final note: I am particularly enamored of the added molasses element which provides the punctuation of a product based on it. ", which is why it won't make this list. Pusser's and Myers's are absolute classics and represent a real piece of history, and honestly are both must buys, anytime, any place, any way... Steal em if you have to!
Both Smith & Cross and W&N belong on this list.
I raised a question with Jimbo about Myer's Legend, which got a 10.5 aggregate score, but obviously has loads of coloring and other stuff added. He said
which I guess means that it's been like that for a very long time, and it's not some new market-scamming technique that many of the newer, altered rums are trying to pull.Myers's is quite literally an old, venerable and dependable legend,
*******
Capn's Log: The scoring on the Legend was a bit tongue-in-cheek (insofar as Sue Sea's "12"), but "9" I gave it is accurate. We also stated on the review: "It is the umami of spirits and is truly a history of rum in a glass. One final note: I am particularly enamored of the added molasses element which provides the punctuation of a product based on it. ", which is why it won't make this list. Pusser's and Myers's are absolute classics and represent a real piece of history, and honestly are both must buys, anytime, any place, any way... Steal em if you have to!
Both Smith & Cross and W&N belong on this list.
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Capn Jimbo
- Rum Evangelisti and Compleat Idiot
- Posts: 3550
- Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2006 3:53 pm
- Location: Paradise: Fort Lauderdale of course...
- Contact:
And yet another VERY hard to find Barbadian rum...
This would be Mount Gilboa (4 year). This molasses-based rum is triple - yes, triple! - distilled in pot stills, reportedly to 80+%, then spends four years in the typical ex-bourbon barrels. No added anything, period. Count Silvio's reviewer notes that being a single batch product, there is some variance over time.
For a nice review at my good friend Count Silvio's site, be sure to check this out:
http://www.refinedvices.com/mount-gilboa
BTW, it is made by the same distillery that contributes to Mt. Gay's products (which use both pot and column stilled product), but using only the copper pot stills. I would LOVE to find this one...
This would be Mount Gilboa (4 year). This molasses-based rum is triple - yes, triple! - distilled in pot stills, reportedly to 80+%, then spends four years in the typical ex-bourbon barrels. No added anything, period. Count Silvio's reviewer notes that being a single batch product, there is some variance over time.
For a nice review at my good friend Count Silvio's site, be sure to check this out:
http://www.refinedvices.com/mount-gilboa
BTW, it is made by the same distillery that contributes to Mt. Gay's products (which use both pot and column stilled product), but using only the copper pot stills. I would LOVE to find this one...
I didn't say we shouldn't encourage the distillers. I was talking about our personal attitudes to purity. As we can see the list is tiny when comes to unadulterated rum, now being stuck with such a small list to choose from might make it difficult to drink rum. It may be to expensive or not available or you/I may not like that particular rum. So yes don't beat your self up over the purity of rum but do campaign for better purity by all means.da'rum wrote:I must respectfully disagree on two points.
The first being that we shouldn't beat ourselves up over the purity of rum. i think we should strive to encourage rum producers to leave out the 'extra's'. I think adding colour is a waste of time and adding flavour is cheating and detrimental. Of course we shouldn't lose our minds over it as life is too short but we should definitely not give up.
Secondly, I personally WILL stop drinking rum and have stopped drinking some brands that are altered even though the taste is pleasant or passable. If the over all standard of rum does not get better then I'll be drinking fewer and fewer brands and looking only for those that are completely unaltered. Same with Scotch.
Colour I can live with but question the sense in it. I mean who told these companies that customers expect uniform colour across bottlings?
Flavour......no way.
-
Capn Jimbo
- Rum Evangelisti and Compleat Idiot
- Posts: 3550
- Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2006 3:53 pm
- Location: Paradise: Fort Lauderdale of course...
- Contact:
The reality is this. I think, lol....
1. There is no need for coloring. The single malts and bourbon are good examples.
2. I could care less if the master blender takes a pee in the vat - just label it, lol. There is simply no excuse for not labeling the contents in any case. We all want honesty and transparency all the time.
3. I don't believe "uniformity" in color was ever really the objective. It's all about marketing and a darker color implies richness and age. Exhibit A: the Preacher's "Jamaican Black" rum, made so with double-strength soft drink coloring (not E-150a), otherwise light in color and in flavor.
The greatest disappointment I have had was/is Ron Matusalem Gran Reserva's "rum", that actually was actually altered with prune and vanilla extract. According to Richard Seale such alterations are common, and almost expected.
The distillers want us to believe E-150a is added simply to adjust color across the lots for uniformity. If only that were so. The truth is that true (and legal) E-150a (spirit caramel) is extremely bitter, but fortunately is so potent that literal drops are needed (think 0.01%). E-150a is classified as neither a food or a flavoring. OTOH, carmelization to brown or dark food caramel IS considered a rich flavor, IS considered a food, AND they also add color to the product.
I suspect many rums use these darker and rich food caramels, to skirt the regulations (which allow bitter spirit coloring caramel), which aren't really enforced anyway. Regulation is lax, and often depends on the statement made by the distiller.
Flat Ass Bottom Line
The reality: fortunately, there are some fine, relatively pure and unaltered rums for which we may or may not have to tolerate a tiny bit of E-150a, or not. This thread has identified many of them, and there are more (I'm waiting to see who posts them). These are enough to please most of us, I'm sure. There are fine examples in every style. Still, rum will never, come anywhere near the wide selection of single malts, find blended whiskies (think Glaser), or bourbons/ryes.
What we can do is to be sure to spread the word, and to post where possible to out them. See someone raving about Diplomatico? A comment to the effect that you don't like dishonest rums that are heavily altered and sweetened, but don't say so. Use terms like "real", "pure" and "unaltered" rum. Ask "Do you want purity and true quality, or don't you care if you're drinking a cheap rum altered to appear complex? Trust me, posting works, the word spreads. Just a few years ago the Zee rums, the Dee rums and the Pee rums were held out as fine rums. Now at least they are recognized as being seriously altered.
That's progress. And remember, the world of rum sites remains small, and most of them will allow posts. Your comments count and will serve to educate others, and the grass will grow. Others who agree but remained silent will join you. But only if you rain on their parade. (What horrible similes, si?)...
I know you know this stuff, so sorry for the rant... but at least it's a real and pure one, from years of experience and honest aging, lol. No additives except for my BP meds...
1. There is no need for coloring. The single malts and bourbon are good examples.
2. I could care less if the master blender takes a pee in the vat - just label it, lol. There is simply no excuse for not labeling the contents in any case. We all want honesty and transparency all the time.
3. I don't believe "uniformity" in color was ever really the objective. It's all about marketing and a darker color implies richness and age. Exhibit A: the Preacher's "Jamaican Black" rum, made so with double-strength soft drink coloring (not E-150a), otherwise light in color and in flavor.
The greatest disappointment I have had was/is Ron Matusalem Gran Reserva's "rum", that actually was actually altered with prune and vanilla extract. According to Richard Seale such alterations are common, and almost expected.
The distillers want us to believe E-150a is added simply to adjust color across the lots for uniformity. If only that were so. The truth is that true (and legal) E-150a (spirit caramel) is extremely bitter, but fortunately is so potent that literal drops are needed (think 0.01%). E-150a is classified as neither a food or a flavoring. OTOH, carmelization to brown or dark food caramel IS considered a rich flavor, IS considered a food, AND they also add color to the product.
I suspect many rums use these darker and rich food caramels, to skirt the regulations (which allow bitter spirit coloring caramel), which aren't really enforced anyway. Regulation is lax, and often depends on the statement made by the distiller.
Flat Ass Bottom Line
The reality: fortunately, there are some fine, relatively pure and unaltered rums for which we may or may not have to tolerate a tiny bit of E-150a, or not. This thread has identified many of them, and there are more (I'm waiting to see who posts them). These are enough to please most of us, I'm sure. There are fine examples in every style. Still, rum will never, come anywhere near the wide selection of single malts, find blended whiskies (think Glaser), or bourbons/ryes.
What we can do is to be sure to spread the word, and to post where possible to out them. See someone raving about Diplomatico? A comment to the effect that you don't like dishonest rums that are heavily altered and sweetened, but don't say so. Use terms like "real", "pure" and "unaltered" rum. Ask "Do you want purity and true quality, or don't you care if you're drinking a cheap rum altered to appear complex? Trust me, posting works, the word spreads. Just a few years ago the Zee rums, the Dee rums and the Pee rums were held out as fine rums. Now at least they are recognized as being seriously altered.
That's progress. And remember, the world of rum sites remains small, and most of them will allow posts. Your comments count and will serve to educate others, and the grass will grow. Others who agree but remained silent will join you. But only if you rain on their parade. (What horrible similes, si?)...
I know you know this stuff, so sorry for the rant... but at least it's a real and pure one, from years of experience and honest aging, lol. No additives except for my BP meds...
I may not be the biggest fan of AOC Martinique rums in general, but those brands which are produced under the set of rules, are not flavour-fixed - this is strictly forbidden in the production methodology rules.
Overall, it is really hard to say which rums are flavoured, because of the secrecy and lies that surround this topic. Very few have admitted the use of additives (or made a blunder like Matusalem did, thus slipping the truth out). Philippines rum maker Tanduay is the only one I know of, that admits use of additives on their website.
In any case, tasting rums from known distilleries (which have their own blends out there also), bottled by Bristol Spirits, Velier, Cadenheads and their likes give one an idea of just how much the original brands tamper their spirits at some point before bottling. An experience highly recommended!!!
I tried a Cuban rum from Bristol Spirits, from the Sancti Spiritus distillery. Needless to say, this "real" Cuban rum was unlike anything they push out of that country under commercial, larger brands. HUGE difference. I believe that Havana Club rums are definitely all "treated" - or follow an "age-old recipe"...
Another fact is, that many existing commercial blends from known distilleries actually may also contain rum which was NOT made by that distillery even. Some portions of the spirit blended into their brands have been purchased from the vast, somewhat anonymous bulk rum markets. This is how rum made at Angostura gets into Bacardi for example, etc. Fun huh?
No small-batch bottling of Demerara rum matches or even resembles the El Dorado bottlings, which are all sugarcoated beyond these days. What else is done - well, no idea, they aren't speaking out. Do try real Guyanese from the same distillery and stills, you will be surprised.
I suspect from mouthfeel, flavour and overall experience that rums from Reunion distilleries are not fixed. Riviere du Mat, Savana rum - both seem 100% genuine. No facts, but..taste them and see.
I think the most funny thing about rum is that 99,9% of people think the spirit is sweet after distillation, because the raw material of cane juice or molasses. Rum is actually quite dry - as are other spirits too.
Overall, it is really hard to say which rums are flavoured, because of the secrecy and lies that surround this topic. Very few have admitted the use of additives (or made a blunder like Matusalem did, thus slipping the truth out). Philippines rum maker Tanduay is the only one I know of, that admits use of additives on their website.
In any case, tasting rums from known distilleries (which have their own blends out there also), bottled by Bristol Spirits, Velier, Cadenheads and their likes give one an idea of just how much the original brands tamper their spirits at some point before bottling. An experience highly recommended!!!
I tried a Cuban rum from Bristol Spirits, from the Sancti Spiritus distillery. Needless to say, this "real" Cuban rum was unlike anything they push out of that country under commercial, larger brands. HUGE difference. I believe that Havana Club rums are definitely all "treated" - or follow an "age-old recipe"...
Another fact is, that many existing commercial blends from known distilleries actually may also contain rum which was NOT made by that distillery even. Some portions of the spirit blended into their brands have been purchased from the vast, somewhat anonymous bulk rum markets. This is how rum made at Angostura gets into Bacardi for example, etc. Fun huh?
No small-batch bottling of Demerara rum matches or even resembles the El Dorado bottlings, which are all sugarcoated beyond these days. What else is done - well, no idea, they aren't speaking out. Do try real Guyanese from the same distillery and stills, you will be surprised.
I suspect from mouthfeel, flavour and overall experience that rums from Reunion distilleries are not fixed. Riviere du Mat, Savana rum - both seem 100% genuine. No facts, but..taste them and see.
I think the most funny thing about rum is that 99,9% of people think the spirit is sweet after distillation, because the raw material of cane juice or molasses. Rum is actually quite dry - as are other spirits too.
Great post JaRiMi!
And yes it matters and yes I have stopped drinking many Rums because they were obviously altered and I will continue to do so. I MIGHT use it in a cocktail but will no longer pour it neat. Added sweetness in Rum is a big reason I find Bourbon much more interesting and complex. I really think Rum CAN be a world class spirit but right now most are something else and not worth savoring or contemplating. Much the way cola drinks are tasty but not worth much thought.
This is a quote that is the entire back label of my bottle of Cadenheads 25yr Green Label Demerara Rum;
"This rum has been bottled under the sole responsibility of William Cadenhead Ltd. With the exception of water added to bring the rum to drinking strength it has been bottled in it's natural state. It has not been treated to change it's color and is free from all additives. It has not been subjected to any chill filtering that might remove natural constituents and spoil it's flavor."
What I want is for many more rums to be able to put that statement on their best bottle of sipping juice.
BTW - the Cadenhead 25yr is a wonderful rum.. Dark, lovely complex nose, then a light entry with a significant dryness and subtle bitterness leading to a dry almost (but not quite) sweet finish. Balanced and masculine.
And yes it matters and yes I have stopped drinking many Rums because they were obviously altered and I will continue to do so. I MIGHT use it in a cocktail but will no longer pour it neat. Added sweetness in Rum is a big reason I find Bourbon much more interesting and complex. I really think Rum CAN be a world class spirit but right now most are something else and not worth savoring or contemplating. Much the way cola drinks are tasty but not worth much thought.
This is a quote that is the entire back label of my bottle of Cadenheads 25yr Green Label Demerara Rum;
"This rum has been bottled under the sole responsibility of William Cadenhead Ltd. With the exception of water added to bring the rum to drinking strength it has been bottled in it's natural state. It has not been treated to change it's color and is free from all additives. It has not been subjected to any chill filtering that might remove natural constituents and spoil it's flavor."
What I want is for many more rums to be able to put that statement on their best bottle of sipping juice.
BTW - the Cadenhead 25yr is a wonderful rum.. Dark, lovely complex nose, then a light entry with a significant dryness and subtle bitterness leading to a dry almost (but not quite) sweet finish. Balanced and masculine.
Genuine, bust head, no bullshit Rum. Cadenhead 25yr Green Label Demerara rum. This is the base line for Demerara un fooked with flavors. There are very many similarities with Clement Single Cask 8yr and yet one is an agricole and one is a demeraran.
After tasting them I can only put two rums on the guaranteed un fooked with list all the rest seem to have sweeteners added.;
Cadenhead 25yr
Clement Single Cask
This is a quote that is the entire back label of my bottle of Cadenheads 25yr Green Label Demerara Rum;
After tasting them I can only put two rums on the guaranteed un fooked with list all the rest seem to have sweeteners added.;
Cadenhead 25yr
Clement Single Cask
This is a quote that is the entire back label of my bottle of Cadenheads 25yr Green Label Demerara Rum;
THAT's what I'm talking about!"This rum has been bottled under the sole responsibility of William Cadenhead Ltd. With the exception of water added to bring the rum to drinking strength it has been bottled in it's natural state. It has not been treated to change it's color and is free from all additives. It has not been subjected to any chill filtering that might remove natural constituents and spoil it's flavor."