So this is based on how we think that the IB bottlers might be buying rum.
Could they be buying casks?
What casks do we expect that distilleries might be using?
If IB 's are maturing the rum, how long would they wait?
IB bottlers
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The Black Tot
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Not sure tbh. I think we can try cover as many IBs as possible..
Perhaps ask a certain set of questions and see if they respond.
For example, there are lots of Guyana releases which use names of old distilleries. How many are products of these or the corresponding stills (as BAT has analysed).
How do the IBs know the distillery or the style of distillation?
Perhaps ask a certain set of questions and see if they respond.
For example, there are lots of Guyana releases which use names of old distilleries. How many are products of these or the corresponding stills (as BAT has analysed).
How do the IBs know the distillery or the style of distillation?
I suspect in the case of Demerara ones, they were bought when the distilleries were still separate. The last of the consolidation wasn't until the early 2000s. Also, DDL still produces various marques from their array of stills - as we know, Pusser's claims that its Dem component comes only from the wooden vat stills.
They tend to use their own, carefully selected casks, from what I've gathered, which is why their stuff is such high quality. Most I'm sure are used bourbon barrels, others, such as Bristol, sometimes uses port barrels, etc.
Most of the IB rums I've seen are anywhere from 8-25 years old. My Cadenhead PM Demerara is 14 years old, distilled in 1991 and bottled in 2006 (I only bought in December, so I'm not sure what Cadenhead was doing with it sitting in the bottle for 8 years!). My Bristol Classic Jamaica is 9 years, my Berry Bros JA is 10, my Berry Bros Enmore is 16. Samaroli has an ancient Demerara, and younger ones from there and elswhere. Can't speak for Mezan, don't know enough about them.
They tend to use their own, carefully selected casks, from what I've gathered, which is why their stuff is such high quality. Most I'm sure are used bourbon barrels, others, such as Bristol, sometimes uses port barrels, etc.
Most of the IB rums I've seen are anywhere from 8-25 years old. My Cadenhead PM Demerara is 14 years old, distilled in 1991 and bottled in 2006 (I only bought in December, so I'm not sure what Cadenhead was doing with it sitting in the bottle for 8 years!). My Bristol Classic Jamaica is 9 years, my Berry Bros JA is 10, my Berry Bros Enmore is 16. Samaroli has an ancient Demerara, and younger ones from there and elswhere. Can't speak for Mezan, don't know enough about them.
So your Cadenhead PM was not for sale since 2006?!
I am interested in seeing many rum releases being available many years after the bottling date. Is this due to not being released at the bottling date or lack of demand?
Wonder how many of the IB do manage to go for example to Guyana and select casks. Can they do so? And is DDL interested in the selling single casks or are they more interested in bulk rum?
I am interested in seeing many rum releases being available many years after the bottling date. Is this due to not being released at the bottling date or lack of demand?
Wonder how many of the IB do manage to go for example to Guyana and select casks. Can they do so? And is DDL interested in the selling single casks or are they more interested in bulk rum?
I have no idea! The label says distilled 1991, bottled 2006, and I didn't buy it until a few days before Christmas, right off the shelf at Cadenhead's tasting room.AK9 wrote:So your Cadenhead PM was not for sale since 2006?!
I am interested in seeing many rum releases being available many years after the bottling date. Is this due to not being released at the bottling date or lack of demand?
Do the IB bottlers have so much stock that it has not sold out?
Over the week saw that Master of Malt had new arrivals of Bristol Rum which has been bottled over some time.
And I ordered a rum, which the retailer informed me that he would receive next bottles in 1-2 weeks (has been bottled in 2012).
Over the week saw that Master of Malt had new arrivals of Bristol Rum which has been bottled over some time.
And I ordered a rum, which the retailer informed me that he would receive next bottles in 1-2 weeks (has been bottled in 2012).
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The Black Tot
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I can't answer you but given the dominance of the G&Ms and the Cadenheads in the whisky world, I BET you can find info on google about how they approach it for whisky. For rum I'm sure it's no different.AK9 wrote:Good news then!
This will keep prices down and hope there is lots of 70s/80s rum.
So far how do IB bottle these casks? Do they taste continouisly and release when they feel they are "right"?
Since when Did MOM start doing Bristol rum?AK9 wrote:Do the IB bottlers have so much stock that it has not sold out?
Over the week saw that Master of Malt had new arrivals of Bristol Rum which has been bottled over some time.
And I ordered a rum, which the retailer informed me that he would receive next bottles in 1-2 weeks (has been bottled in 2012).
I think the 70s Guyanese is soon out of stock guys...Also the existing bottlings have seen a huge rise in price - if you are able to still find any. Its getting much more difficult. If there is still 70s Demrum somewhere in warehouse, I'd hurry up and bottle it, and sell it at the existing high price before it is all wood.
Velier to my knowledge has invested money into DDL, and this is why they have been getting superb bottlings out from selected casks/combinations of them. Both Velier and Bristol bought to my knowledge casks from Caroni directly also.
Some rums I gather are bought from bulk shipments, and some are traded for others amongst these companies. None of the independent bottlers release say 10,000 bottles of the same vintage from same distillery - so amounts vary from single casks to combinations of 8 - 24 casks for example (sans the angel's share). Milroys of Soho did a really nice Foursquare bottling some good 7 years back or so..where did this rum find its way to them? No idea. Glad they got it though, it was lovely.
For rums like Rockely still, I don't think they were shipped in bulk containers to UK, because as I understood, they were not made in huge quantity even at Bim originally with the old still. Casks someone managed to nab at one time or another, all the older ones were also vintage 1986. Now Rum Swedes have newer stock also, great stuff indeed but not a whole lot floating around.
Tasting & bottling.... if you have your own aging warehouses (a lot of indys do not), you can sample the casks when you wish with little extra cost. If you rent space, especially from a big company, they will charge you good money for any and all samples you need from your own cask - so you'd probably like to minimize the annual sampling. But I am sure they do their best to predict and see when to bottle any particular rum, because A) it can spoil if kept too long in a cask, and B) there will be less of it to bottle every year.
Velier to my knowledge has invested money into DDL, and this is why they have been getting superb bottlings out from selected casks/combinations of them. Both Velier and Bristol bought to my knowledge casks from Caroni directly also.
Some rums I gather are bought from bulk shipments, and some are traded for others amongst these companies. None of the independent bottlers release say 10,000 bottles of the same vintage from same distillery - so amounts vary from single casks to combinations of 8 - 24 casks for example (sans the angel's share). Milroys of Soho did a really nice Foursquare bottling some good 7 years back or so..where did this rum find its way to them? No idea. Glad they got it though, it was lovely.
For rums like Rockely still, I don't think they were shipped in bulk containers to UK, because as I understood, they were not made in huge quantity even at Bim originally with the old still. Casks someone managed to nab at one time or another, all the older ones were also vintage 1986. Now Rum Swedes have newer stock also, great stuff indeed but not a whole lot floating around.
Tasting & bottling.... if you have your own aging warehouses (a lot of indys do not), you can sample the casks when you wish with little extra cost. If you rent space, especially from a big company, they will charge you good money for any and all samples you need from your own cask - so you'd probably like to minimize the annual sampling. But I am sure they do their best to predict and see when to bottle any particular rum, because A) it can spoil if kept too long in a cask, and B) there will be less of it to bottle every year.
Thanks for the response!
Sad to have missed he 70s ones.. However there is alot of 80s/90s rum around and some of which is very logical priced (see Bristol).
It is quite interesing how many different IB bottlers bottle same years from same distilleries/or distillery style (75-PM, 88-uitv, 90-Enmore,99-PM)
I am very suprised that DDL allows Velier to get their hands on casks. Surely this must be antagonising their El Dorado sales?
The Swedes one is from Rockley stills as well? Need to check it out.
Really hope that cadenhead have missed a barrel here and there.. They do this with whisky sometimes.
Sad to have missed he 70s ones.. However there is alot of 80s/90s rum around and some of which is very logical priced (see Bristol).
It is quite interesing how many different IB bottlers bottle same years from same distilleries/or distillery style (75-PM, 88-uitv, 90-Enmore,99-PM)
I am very suprised that DDL allows Velier to get their hands on casks. Surely this must be antagonising their El Dorado sales?
The Swedes one is from Rockley stills as well? Need to check it out.
Really hope that cadenhead have missed a barrel here and there.. They do this with whisky sometimes.